tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8044318176622758692.post7465568955849555123..comments2024-03-01T03:51:38.081-05:00Comments on Allergic to Bull: An Indecent Federal Proposal: The Second Session in the Obamacare Argument TodayA.W.http://www.blogger.com/profile/10876021589516844048noreply@blogger.comBlogger5125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8044318176622758692.post-59768395374114320802012-04-01T21:03:43.871-04:002012-04-01T21:03:43.871-04:00Thank you for the memory of the movie, and I love ...Thank you for the memory of the movie, and I love that song, too. It all really impacted me at the time; mixed emotions. The words sensual and provocative just don't do the film justice. Oh, what was the question?? :) ..CLUnknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00806026616055923789noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8044318176622758692.post-84779342863209989742012-03-29T12:16:38.349-04:002012-03-29T12:16:38.349-04:00>> If you will read here you will see that n...>> If you will read here you will see that no one, not even Obama, thinks Obamacare is a money saving rule.<br /><br />Your link cites an article which is inaccurate and has been debunked. The CBO numbers discussed in the article relate to new CBO projections regarding the (1) GROSS (not net) cost of (2) <i>one aspect</i> of the Affordable Care Act. In other words, the articles refers to an increased cost of coverage estimates under Obamacare, <i>before revenues and the tax effects take place</i>. <a href="http://www.tnr.com/blog/jonathan-cohn/101741/cbo-obamacare-cost-deficit-lie-double-price-fox" rel="nofollow">Read here</a> for more explanation, or the Reuters report which managed to get it right.<br /><br />>> So if you strike down the pre-existing condition rule, it means that insurance companies… will be allowed to sell insurance again.<br /><br />You seem to think that having A pre-existing condition means you have all possible pre-existing conditions. Insurance is still insurance whether you have a pre-existing condition or not, since insurance is comrephensive (it covers things that I don't have, but I might someday).<br /><br />>> And if Obamacare was a republican idea, then how come no republicans voted for it. <br /><br />Because it was OBAMAcare. Just like when they tried to block Obama's plan to cut the business payroll tax (something Republicans would normally be in favor of). They don't want to hand Obama a win of any kind.<br /><br />>> Yes, the heritage foundation pushed the idea at one time. But they don’t represent the republican party.<br /><br />Wrong again. Republicans actively sponsored health reform legislation which included a mandate. They did it in in <a href="http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/bdquery/z?d103:SN01770:" rel="nofollow">1993</a>, <a href="http://www.govtrack.us/congress/bills/103/s1743" rel="nofollow">1994</a>, <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Healthy_Americans_Act" rel="nofollow">2007</a>, and as recently as <a href="http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=5&ved=0CEgQFjAE&url=http%3A%2F%2Fthinkprogress.org%2Fhealth%2F2010%2F03%2F25%2F171336%2Fgrassley-constitutional-now%2F&ei=0D5wT72DFKnu0gH-86XbBg&usg=AFQjCNHsGqIIdhmJvN5Nnh91f1cnM25JwQ" rel="nofollow">2009</a>.<br /><br />>> And as for the hope that democrats will pass what they really want next time, first I doubt anyone will hand power over to them anytime soon.<br /><br />Like November 2012? Don't hold your breath. If the mandate fails at the Supreme Court level, this will energize the base like you wouldn't believe.Ken Ashfordhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00288895770874372009noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8044318176622758692.post-10882133611230345232012-03-29T11:42:40.516-04:002012-03-29T11:42:40.516-04:00Aaron - Excellent coverage of the issue.
I agree ...Aaron - Excellent coverage of the issue.<br /><br />I agree with Ken's position above. There's no severability clause. It's beyond the scope of the judge's ability to determine which other provisions of the Act were included as a result of political horsetrading, can stand on their own, or can on their own without doing irreparable damage, let alone what the actual legislative intent was, given the public posturing but secrecy and closed door meetings under which the Act was drafted.<br /><br />It seems the only logical step is to give it back to Congress to draft a fresh bill which embodies its legislative intent without a mandate or come up with a new alternative.<br /><br />BTW, Kagan's snark about 26 year-olds on the policies of their parents is just BS. It used to be that adding another child to the policy of a parent resulted in a minor cost increase. The situations in which parents are going to add up to 26 year-old children to their policies are now going to include those of adverse selection who cannot get policies on their own, rather than the entire universe of healthy 26 year-olds which Kagan describes. Fail on her part.<br /><br />I still hate your commenting system!daleyrockshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08708426495566496374noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8044318176622758692.post-76569025644713956622012-03-29T11:26:39.348-04:002012-03-29T11:26:39.348-04:00Ken
I won’t nitpick your analysis too much not be...Ken<br /><br />I won’t nitpick your analysis too much not because I don’t disagree, but going through the tea leaves is so opinionated, that there isn’t much to say. It’s like arguing who is better, Picasso or Dali. You might feel strongly one way or the other, but its really hard to argue someone is clearly wrong.<br /><br />That being said, I don’t think that it is just plain normal psychology to suggest that Kennedy will want to call it constitutional because of the difficulty in severing only part of it out. I think its more likely to make him say “to hell with the whole thing.”<br /><br />And I couldn’t let your claim that this will add to the deficit go unanswered. If you will read here you will see that no one, not even Obama, thinks Obamacare is a money saving rule.<br /><br />http://news.yahoo.com/obamacare-won-t-add-dime-deficit-add-1-231800123.html<br /><br />Although to be fair to you, when he was selling it, Obama regularly claimed that this would save us money on the deficit.<br /><br />As for pre-existing conditions and the like... sheesh, Ken what do you think insurance means?<br /><br />Admittedly we have badly warped this concept, but insurance is something you buy when you don’t have a problem, to deal with when something surprising happens to you. You don’t buy auto accident insurance after you crash into someone and expect them to cover the wreck you just had. You don’t get fire insurance when your house is in cinders (not for that fire, anyway). And once you are dead, your loved ones cannot take out a life insurance policy on you.<br /><br />So if you strike down the pre-existing condition rule, it means that insurance companies… will be allowed to sell insurance again.<br /><br />I will say something else. The whole plan, like many liberal social welfare schemes, requires a lot of young people to pay for it. That is true of social security, too, and several other things.<br /><br />One of the main reasons that SS is going bankrupt is… because our birth rate has fallen off so severely. So it is interesting that the same party who not only support abortion, and loves birth control so much that they believe all women should get it for free, is the one building programs on the premise of a high birth rate.<br /><br />And if Obamacare was a republican idea, then how come no republicans voted for it. Indeed, you had to use legislative shenanigans to prevent the election of a republican IN MASSACHUSETTS from deep-sixing the vote.<br /><br />Yes, the heritage foundation pushed the idea at one time. But they don’t represent the republican party.<br /><br />And as for the hope that democrats will pass what they really want next time, first I doubt anyone will hand power over to them anytime soon. Second, this thing has been so bad for them, I doubt it. They will have to do some very serious rationalization to believe it is anything but electoral suicide.<br /><br />And in any case, i certainly am not predicting that outcome.A.W.https://www.blogger.com/profile/10876021589516844048noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8044318176622758692.post-38282550105249689572012-03-29T09:48:18.515-04:002012-03-29T09:48:18.515-04:00Well, thoughtful coverage of the Obamacare hearing...Well, thoughtful coverage of the Obamacare hearings. Kudos for the effort.<br /><br />I'm largely pessimistic about Obamacare's chances. My hopes for Scalia surprising everyone are dashed beyond recognition. I am, truth be told, a TINY bit more optimistic after Day 3. I think Kennedy might be so overwhelmed by the remedy (severability) issue that he might go back and reconsider the constitutionality of the mandate. And I also think Roberts is in play if only because he wants to write an opinion which allows the mandate but sets the limit on the commerce clause (in other words, he wants to answer the "why not broccoli" question).<br /><br />You can accuse me of wishful thinking, and I wouldn't disagree.<br /><br />But assuming the mandate fails constitutionality, I don't see how Obamacare can be severed. I think you give it back to Congress.<br /><br />And that's a shame. Insurance companies will start denying claims for pre-existing conditions; lots of 20-somethings will no longer be on their parents' insurance; and $2 trillion gets added to the debt. It won't be a defeat for Obama so much as a defeat for America. And all because the Supreme Court wants to protect the rights of a small minority of free loaders, whose health care costs will be shouldered by the rest of us responsible enough to get health insurance.<br /><br />The silver lining (as I think you predicted, although you don't think it is a "silver lining") is that the failure of Obamacare could very well lead to a single-payer health care system like they have in Canada or elsewhere. That would have been preferable to liberals like me -- Obamacare was a Republican idea and served as a COMPROMISE. But I'm not sure the nation is willing to refight health care again. Not now.Ken Ashfordhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00288895770874372009noreply@blogger.com